A debate is taking place on Joomla Community about Unified Content Model (UCM).

UCM concept is to virtualize database.

The ucm table is handling common functionalities in one unique table. The wizards in Cook.

So every object can benefits automatically from all avalaible table behaviors. This point is nice.
The content datas are stored in separated tables (your current tables in Cook)
With UCM, Published, Access, Ordering, .... are now physically separated from their original row table in database.

For creating websites it is nice very, but for building complex applications it seems to be a complex approach for only few benefits, such as reducing the coding.
Instead of that, this politic is gonna raise more inconvenients :
- more CPU, longer SQL queries, more embedded php and SQL
- Lost space in DB when features are not fully used by the table
- Complex to backup 'Only your component', or extract datas for import / export
- Joomla is already dealing very well with published field for all tables, without UCM
- Useless ?

The new tagging system is working with UCM.

The philosophy of cook has always be to separate datas in separate tables not using Joomla categories for instance (well for the moment)
What about customizing the behaviors of thoses behaviors ?
What about FK accesses propagations ?


What do you think about it. Cook is not designed for that for the moment. But if users wants I need to think about it now.

eventually ORM is a good system.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Object-relational_mapping

ORM is a totally different way of thinking. Replacing even MVC and relational databases.

With ORM, the developper deal with classes, and the SQL queries are created automatically, for all sub objects.
Every class property is configured to a table/field in database, and that's it. The ORM system is writing all queries for you.

This could be super interressant to see in Joomla core.
I am also thinking about pushing me in that stuff as far as it seems interresting.

I don't know yet how the ORM works, I'll take a deep look on it, but surely this UCM on joomla doesn't seem to give any improvement at all.

As the Admin said, it requires more resources to the entire system (hardware and software).

this causes a lot of problems if I have a busy web application.
I totally agree with the admin, I would keep jcook completely separated by UCM, forever.

I don't really understand why the joomla key persons sometimes take weird decisions like this. It seems to me there is some "big brother" saying what they have to do and what they don't. I don't know, and I also could be wrong.

my life motto is:
"It is vain to do with more what can be done with fewer" William of Ockham

so anything I do I try to ask myself what would keep everything simple but effective.

Tomaselli wrote: I don't really understand why the joomla key persons sometimes take weird decisions like this. It seems to me there is some "big brother" saying what they have to do and what they don't. I don't know, and I also could be wrong.

I have exaclty the same feeling : lobbying

I did not went to recent internationalt Joomla Days, but as far as I can read discussions about it, it seems that Ebay was using this system but now it is dead. So I don't know...

Wich others frameworks or systems are using this UCM Model ?

I think for developpers it is a loose of time everytime we want to debug.

Maybe just for fun I will bput an option in Cook to try UCM mode, but really when I will have time, and only (for fun and beta)

I wouldn't even try it for fun , the life is too short to have fun with that

I wanted to say only 'instance it' as it is. .. And see what happens if it works...why not ?
In life, to compare advantages and misvantages we need to experiment both sides...
If it is a democratic decision to integrqte in Joomla, then Cook have to follow as well.
It seems that for the moment it is not included in the Framework for a good reason.
The politic of Cook is to be able to run on the plateform alone. (Still never tried shame on me) This is why cook does not use the Joomla categories.
We can say the component could be build oriented CMS or oriented FRAMEWORK

CMS -> UML + Joomla categories + Joomla Tags + ...
FRAMEWORK -> All tables in component

I only need to change few things in the model, suppress functions and supress wizarda fields. Not a big deal I think. One rainy day with curiosity of learning.
I said beta because if it does not work at 100% in details (or for special combinaisons) it will not be fixed. For curious only.

It is absolutly not a priority for cook.

For ORM, I learned it from Herman Peeren :
groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/joomla-dev-cms/yjGYAdXYVVs

Joomla project : docs.joomla.org/GSOC_2013_Project_Ideas#..._.28ORM.29_in_Joomla

I was joking when I said I wouldn't even try it. I usually try everything, that's the only way to have a clear idea about what would be the best option.

I would try it as you just said in a rainy day, but I don't know if my experiments could have any relevance.
At the end, the only important experiments are those done on a "real world" environment, on a busy application with a lot of real users.
Generally speaking I don't like the idea to have everything unified on the same table, it seems to me, it could work just fine on a little website not too busy.

This evening I'll take a look on the ORM, thanks for the links! have someone to tell you what to read is a great way to save time!

SQL, PHP, XML, CRM, MVC, CCK, UCM, ORM, ... I am lost ... lol

Well the 3 letters we need now are :

FoF
(The best thing before Cook, lol)

That's it...
Already in the works.
As well, I am starting to documentate your favorite tool.